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January 5, 2009
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WP's Dragon Guide, part 01 by Paperiapina WP's Dragon Guide, part 01 by Paperiapina
WARNING: Huuuuuuge file ahead!

EDIT:
Part 2: [link]
/EDIT

I mentioned in my latest journal, that I've been working on a dragon related rant-tutorial-ish-guide-sorta-thingy, and this is the beginning of it. This contains the first five pages of my ... umh, thinking? It's just a start, so far I have made 14 pages, but these are the only ones that have been approved by my dragon specialist, Alchi.

The future parts will include thoughts, rants, tips and advice about how I think a good dragons are made.

Although, this thing only covers the usual fantasy dragons, the type known as western type, and it's not valid in making eastern dragons. (Comparing western dragons and eastern dragons is like comparing a lizard and a wind. Western dragons are usually reptile-like winged beasts who spit fire or some similar element (ice, lightning, poison, acid, and I'm pretty sure some people have invented even more of these) where as the deepest essence of an eastern dragon is wind. Eastern dragons are the spirits of rivers and winds, and thus have as much need for wings as clouds do.)

If you have any questions or wishes for what I should include in the following parts, let me know and I'll check what I can do to help you with them.

NOTE: This is only a start, I'm just clearing my throat in here. This first part contains the first five of AT LEAST fourteen pages, probably more to come (as I really REALLY want to poke the idea of dragonriders around, and possibly some other ideas too). So, there will be more. You won't get away from my ramblings this easy.
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:iconveexanya9:
VeeXanya9 Featured By Owner May 26, 2014  Student Traditional Artist
Oh my god, I know that book your talking about. I used to worship it as a kid and still keep it in my bookshelf to this day ^^' Even when I was little I was skeptical about how dragon wings being extra bend would help them fly like bumblebees. Thank you for validating that concern :3
Reply
:iconsaphira1334:
Saphira1334 Featured By Owner Jan 12, 2014  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
OH MY GOD THANK YOU i always hated those big bellied small winged dragons
Reply
:iconthislittlebluebird:
ThisLittleBluebird Featured By Owner Aug 9, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Finally somebody who agrees with me!

Seeing this, I've realized how well-rounded an artist you are! I was a huge fan of Wurr for a while, and I'm only just now finding your page again. I think you have a very active new watcher! C:
Reply
:icondragonflame123:
DragonFlame123 Featured By Owner Jun 20, 2013  Student Traditional Artist
Interesting
Reply
:iconbluedramon:
Bluedramon Featured By Owner Mar 20, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
"Dragons could fly because their wings were uber-flexible."

Even the animated movie Flight Of Dragons offered a better explanation than that.
Reply
:iconlostkavi:
Lostkavi Featured By Owner Jun 22, 2011
Oh crap, the more i read, the funnier it gets. the really aweful jokes are hysterical because that sort of half-assed humour is at least constant. (fell out of chair laughing) :lmao:
Reply
:iconifoldbooks:
IFoldBooks Featured By Owner Jun 22, 2011  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Haha, an interesting and amazing insight to dragon anatomy. Full of humor too, cracked me up quite a number of times :D. I love the way you ranted on and on about how conventional dragons. Made for a rather amusing read.

Oh, and of course, very informative. Instead of just telling us how to draw dragons like other tutorials, you tell us why too! A very good tutorial! :)
Reply
:iconlostkavi:
Lostkavi Featured By Owner Jun 22, 2011
:D I love it! I can't draw for crap, but it's still great.
eheh (nudge nudge) If you want the notion of dragon riders poked at, check the novel in my gallery, Dynasty of Dragons. If it's your sort of read, I think you might like it.

Anyway, your stuff - Liking it!
Reply
:iconlostkavi:
Lostkavi Featured By Owner Jun 22, 2011
:D I love it! I can't draw for crap, but it's still great.
eheh (nudge nudge) If you want the notion of dragon riders poked at, check the novel in my gallery, Dynasty of Dragons. If it's your sort of read, I think you might like it.

Anyway, your stuff - Liking it!
Reply
:icondragonlegend13:
DragonLegend13 Featured By Owner Jun 22, 2011  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
You make some very good points there:)
I always try to give my dragons good flight muscle but their front legs keep getting in the wayXD
Reply
:iconkiinkoon:
kiinkoon Featured By Owner Feb 20, 2011
I just love the "Let's make it NAKED!"
Reply
:iconakizuryuuri:
AkizuRyuuri Featured By Owner Nov 1, 2010  Hobbyist General Artist
Ohmycheesefries. I think I love you XD Translation: I've been trying to tell the world all this forever! You really hit the nail on the head with the main points in one package

*Despises Spyro art styles that completely pervade dragon lovers/enthusiasts everywhere who are too stupid to even think of the logical excuse that their 'magic' aids flight, but whatever... We're not talking about that now 8P*
Reply
:iconenju-yanazaki:
Enju-Yanazaki Featured By Owner Apr 16, 2010
Finally! Someone who thinks like me!
Reply
:iconxannerz:
Xannerz Featured By Owner Feb 15, 2010  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
AWESOME. :la:
Reply
:iconpikkuotus:
Pikkuotus Featured By Owner Jan 8, 2010
Nämä ovat erittäin hienoja ja järkeviä, ja toimii tuo kun muistutetaan että kyllä, siivetkin ovat raajoja. :3
Ja ikävä myöntää, mutta minulla on se kirja josta puhuttiin (uskoisin ainakin?) Se kuulosti erittäin järkevältä kun olin 9.
Reply
:iconlittle-miss-perkele:
Little-Miss-Perkele Featured By Owner Jan 6, 2010   Artisan Crafter
Finally! Someone else who is also anoyed by this little problem! :D
Reply
:iconarkoonuva:
ArkoOnuva Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2009
This is something Ive been arguing about for almost my whole freaking life! I'm glad somebody is finally posting!
Reply
:iconcuniculosa:
Cuniculosa Featured By Owner Jan 18, 2009
My mom is always ranting about this... hope you don't mind me showing her, she'd get a kick out of it.

This is why I like lindorms. All this dispute about wings goes poof! in the face of the mighty lindorm.
Reply
:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student General Artist
Heh, I'm glad if I can amuse your mom.

Or the oriental dragons! At least in my opinion, if you are the pure essence of wind, why would you need wings. They'd only slow them down.
Reply
:iconlillacmess:
lillacmess Featured By Owner Jan 18, 2009  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
i like both tutorials!funny and realistic. nice to see someone who wants these little draggies to fly!
Reply
:iconanonymous543:
Anonymous543 Featured By Owner Jan 12, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
Guh, thank you for ranting this. It's true, and so many dragons I see wouldn't be able to fly >.<
Reply
:icongranlundaren:
granlundaren Featured By Owner Jan 8, 2009
You should make a PS version of this, and then make it a tiny little book or something. xD I like it so far! ^^
Reply
:icongranlundaren:
granlundaren Featured By Owner Jan 23, 2009
PS version = Photoshop version... To me, at least. :XD:
It'd be rad if you'd actually write a book on this. =)
Reply
:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student General Artist
Umh, what's PS version?
But yeah, I think this could actually be made into a book. I just talked with m,y friend about this, and considering the amount of stuff I know (or am willing to find out) could almost fill a actual book. (And if I can make anything better than Christopher Hart with his Manga Mania series, it'd be worth it...)
Reply
:iconcat-heron:
Cat-Heron Featured By Owner Jan 6, 2009  Student Digital Artist
Read the whole thing through, I couldn't agree with you more :heart: I now better understand how dragons and birds will have to be able to fly, and gives me greater perspective of drawing flying things. I know this is only part of the guide, but it still explains a lot and helps me a lot <3 Thank you so much!
Reply
:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student General Artist
Thank yous for thank yous! ^^ I'm glad I've been able to help people with this pile of scribbles.
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:iconcat-heron:
Cat-Heron Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student Digital Artist
You're very much welcome :heart: I see a tower of awesome, not a pile of scribbles =3
Reply
:iconxenothere:
Xenothere Featured By Owner Jan 6, 2009
Thank you!
Reply
:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student General Artist
My pleasure! ^^
Reply
:iconclaramferreira:
ClaraMFerreira Featured By Owner Jan 6, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
Don't forget to mention that birds lost and gained a lot of stuff to get themselves into the air easily, like the lost of their teeth, appearance of a keeled sternum, a light yet strong skeleton with air spaces in their bones, fused bones (pelvis, legs, etc), air sacs, etc etc. Plus, they are just round to improve their aerodynamics =P

(and pssst, flight muscles don't go all the way to the butt, they just cover the keel (which for its turn, supports the flight muscles), the abdomen (soft part that's not covered by the keel and flight muscles) is small and hard to differ most of the times, but it's there. Just pointing that out ;))

And hurray for a good tutorial on dragons. =D
Reply
:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student General Artist
I'll see what I can do. ^^

(Oh, thanks for the information and pointing that one out. I stand corrected, and I'll see if I can edit this somehow at some point.)
Reply
:iconmerlintheferret:
MerlinTheFerret Featured By Owner Jan 6, 2009
Hmmm. My brain is ticking now. I'm going to take a wild guess and say the book you read is called 'Dragonology'. My little cousin has it, and it makes me laugh. Pretty pictures though.
Reply
:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 7, 2009  Student General Artist
Ah, you caught me in the act! Heh, you sure recognised the right book. I own it, and just looking at it few days ago inspired me to continue this thing. You can expect a lot more parts of this guide of mine in the future.
Reply
:iconumbbe:
umbbe Featured By Owner Sep 1, 2010  Student Digital Artist
Ho ho - mulla on se monsterologia ja se on käytännössä kämänen kopio Arthur Spiderwickin Luonto-Oppaasta. (suosittelen~ Mahtavia piirroksia ja kekseliästä tekstiä. :D! Myöhäinen kommentti on myöhäinen.)
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:iconmerlintheferret:
MerlinTheFerret Featured By Owner Jan 7, 2009
Huzzah for it then! I enjoyed this first part, looking forward to more!
Reply
:iconsanr4:
sanr4 Featured By Owner Jan 5, 2009  Hobbyist Artisan Crafter
Best.. Thing ever!.. it sounds like one of my essays.. but with pictures!.. ahah I am a ranter to but It was interesting and I learned some things I never knew. I am having a little bit more interest in birds of late because my sister's cokitiels had some eggs that turned in to chicks and its so interesting to see them grow up and grow feathers.. not to mention the babies let you prod and poke them and mess with their wings and their feet much more than their parents would <3

SO your tidbit about birds was very enlightening!
Reply
:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student General Artist
Thank yous! ^^ The pictures are exactly the reason why I did this on paper instead of writing a journal of it or something. I just can't feel like explaining anything without being able to doodle something. My vocabulary is way too small for that (and it's not as interesting to read with no pictures).

Eee, baby birdies! 8D Man, I wish I could have some, I could really need the knowledge of examining a living body. You can learn a lot from barbequed chickens, but a living thing is still too great thing to pass. (Psst, you wouldn't happen to have photos of them?)
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:iconsanr4:
sanr4 Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Hobbyist Artisan Crafter
Well we are getting too many the first 3 hatch lings are already grown up and there are more eggs laid already! that is the issue here.. they like.. keep laying eggs >.<... we need tos ell or give away the babies.. but as soon as the next batch hatches I'll make a point to give you some detailed anatomy shots.. maybe some vidis about how the babies move and flap their bare wings.. its sooo cuute.
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:iconbrushtail-thegreat:
brushtail-thegreat Featured By Owner Jan 5, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
I loved this rant, especially the alarmed little bird. dragon wings can get ridiculous, but they are nothing compared to angels.
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:iconbirvan:
Birvan Featured By Owner Jan 9, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
I absolutely agree with you on that one. Personally I'm against of even the idea of angels being humans with wings attached idiotic (not to mention the toga. How can someone fly with that !?!). But that's because I consider angels too ethereal to have a fixed body shape ^^;

Also another big issue is those feather duster looking wings that almost naked at the shoulders. Seriously, how can anyone expect that to fly?
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:iconbrushtail-thegreat:
brushtail-thegreat Featured By Owner Jan 11, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
well i think it all depends on how attractive the person flying in the toga is, because it is bound to be quite revealing.
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:iconbirvan:
Birvan Featured By Owner Jan 18, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
That and pretty annoying when the wind makes the fabric flap around like a flag and snag on your limbs
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:iconbrushtail-thegreat:
brushtail-thegreat Featured By Owner Jan 19, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
true, having never flown under my own power i really couldn't say.
Reply
:iconbirvan:
Birvan Featured By Owner Jan 20, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
True on that as well. Still I think that could happen when I look at laundry drying on a windy day =p
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:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student General Artist
Man, I just LOVE it when my works inspire conversation. ^^ Too bad I can only answer to one person at a time... Can't comment to both on once.

(Toga is an interesting cloth though. Have you ever noticed that when men wear toga, it usually covers most of their bodies, but when women wear them, they cover a lot less skin.)
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:iconbirvan:
Birvan Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
Considering such an interesting topic, no wonder XD

Yeah, I think it's because if women want to look attractive then they have to wear less bulky togas, while men have to look imposing, impressive and distinct =p
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:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 7, 2009  Student General Artist
Oh, gosh, the Angels! Thanks for reminding me, now I have the urge to fit in some ranting about feathery wings too. Actually, I could draw the new design of my own species of my birdmen sometime, as it's exactly based on the pictures seen all over internet, but just in a way that it could actually work. (Or, at least I really hope they could work)
Reply
:iconbrushtail-thegreat:
brushtail-thegreat Featured By Owner Jan 7, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
no problem, my justification for angels is that they are HOLY!, and so for some reason physics doesn't apply to them.
Reply
:iconpaperiapina:
Paperiapina Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2009  Student General Artist
The holyness (for the lack of better word, my dictionary is lost) is a good excuse, but angels didn't actually have wings at all originally. I don't remember how it exactly was, but I think the wings were added in art somewhere in reneissance perioid (or middle-ages, not sure).

(Although I do admit that even wings that aren't well attached to bodies can look and feel good. Just look at the movie Constantine. There's no way that kind of wings could carry their owner, specially when the owner is human shaped, but for example in the end scene after the credits a person flies with them, and it's made so that it FEELS like flying. And besides, the angels in Constantine don't have their wings all the time, they seem to be an embodyment of a symbol or something. Good movie, though.)
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:iconvol-89:
Vol-89 Featured By Owner Jan 23, 2009
(Plää, yritin selittää tämän enkelisiipijutun englanniksi, että muutkin ymmärtäisi, mutta kielimuuri iski vastaan. Mutta enihuu, siis siivet enkelit tosiaan sai siipensä renessanssi-ajan taiteessa. Koska tuolloin kreikkalaista taidetta ja tiedettä fanitettiin ihan kympillä, enkelit "referoitiin" Kreikan jumalaten sanansaattajasta, Nikestä, jolla oli siivet - ilmeisesti kuvaamassa sanansaattajan nopeutta-(Enkelithän ovat nekin jumalan sanansaattajia.) Samoihin aikoihin myös Neitsyt Mariaa ja Jeesusta alettiin kuvaamaan kreikkalaisten jumalten kaltaisina - taustalla ajatus idealistisesta kauneuden ideasta/Platonin ontologiasta. Kun kattelee keskiajan kirkkotaidetta, niin Jeesus ei siellä ole ihan niin mediaseksikäs ja eurooppalaisen näköinen kuin mitä nykyisin. :D)
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